tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post1021882944638376161..comments2023-10-11T05:59:00.326-07:00Comments on cipofuzo02: Bottlinger's rings!Ágnes Kiricsihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08611168432247808121noreply@blogger.comBlogger19125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-77730781577043819412010-03-30T01:44:23.000-07:002010-03-30T01:44:23.000-07:00This might be the first exclamation mark that I se...This might be the first exclamation mark that I see in Marko's blog postings. The Bottlinger's truly deserve it. Amazing image.Ágnes Kiricsinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-64380650204369228702010-03-30T02:40:32.000-07:002010-03-30T02:40:32.000-07:00Monster photo! Good work!Monster photo! Good work!Patrik Trncaknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-78064338163679265142010-03-30T03:03:38.000-07:002010-03-30T03:03:38.000-07:00Someone should stack all the exposures and see whe...Someone should stack all the exposures and see whether any forms can be seen beyond the second ring. This is a landmark observation and should be explored to the absolute fullest.Jarihttp://jari.pic.fi/kuvat/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-51032842203558395882010-03-30T04:34:10.000-07:002010-03-30T04:34:10.000-07:00Added some more text to post today. Was supposed j...Added some more text to post today. Was supposed just to provide a link to Bottlinger's paper, but somehow text just oozed out.markohttp://www.ursa.fi/~riikonennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-35971212533005565622010-03-30T04:47:32.000-07:002010-03-30T04:47:32.000-07:00Hmm...a jackpot photo.Thanx for the info !Hmm...a jackpot photo.<br><br>Thanx for the info !Markohttp://aoptics.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-50021498709280787292010-03-30T04:49:51.000-07:002010-03-30T04:49:51.000-07:00Magnificent .....Magnificent .....Francesconoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-14126907491006410922010-03-30T07:34:51.000-07:002010-03-30T07:34:51.000-07:00Good luck with a good match simulation folks! A...Good luck with a good match simulation folks! As Marko says "The rings' dimensions and sun elevation are provided, so anybody can give it a try!". I didn’t myself try over hard. This was from a conviction that – like with elliptical halos – there are several parameters that can be adjusted but the simulations don’t converge much. Besides, I was still recovering from falling off the chair on first getting the images! Seriously, the simulation starts off looking promising but as the parameters are altered it doesn’t seem to get that much better. Eventually my mind starts going around in ellipses! The lack of convergence likely tells us that the underlying concepts and model need improvement. However, HaloSim and Jukka’s new HaloPoint are there – give the Bottlinger’s simulations a try!Les Cowleyhttp://www.atoptics.co.uk/opod.htmnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-77283674022398566612010-03-30T07:48:27.000-07:002010-03-30T07:48:27.000-07:00When I saw it, I really thought it must have been ...When I saw it, I really thought it must have been a window artifact. I'd never heard or read of such a display. But I took the pictures anyway, thinking that there was a chance I'd discovered a brand new phenomenon! Turns out I was wrong on both counts, and I'm so glad that the halo community has these photos now.<br><br>By the way, the other people on the plane thought I was insane.Tim Stonehttp://pix.timsworlds.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-11040500814384480342010-03-30T09:13:46.000-07:002010-03-30T09:13:46.000-07:00Fantastic capture, congratulations!Fantastic capture, congratulations!Jukka Ruoskanennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-18179160601644434982010-03-30T12:22:10.000-07:002010-03-30T12:22:10.000-07:00Pretty darn good simulation Jukka! Mind you puttin...Pretty darn good simulation Jukka! Mind you putting also the .par-file available? I think the prism is not a broblem. We have enough examples of snow star like crystals not making parhelia. Recently Jarmo observed in diamond dust circumzenith arc without parhelia. And the <a href="http://www.ursa.fi/~riikonen/floodlightbottlinger/index.htm" rel="nofollow">crystals</a> that made the streelight Bottlinger look to me like they might as well make parhelia, but no parhelia was seen. The simulation softwares assume perfect crystals, which snow star type crystal are not. So, we must artificially shut down some raypaths when simulating these snow star displays.<br><br>And I can believe also the unlikely angles. There is happening something that we don't understand yet. Elliptical halos and Bottlinger's rings form in special conditions from Altocumulus cloud that turn into ice crystals at around -15 C. Supersaturations are high and the short duration of existence of these halos (for elliptical halos often less than one minute) tells that the structure making these halos is very unstable. Also no other halos are seen, except for pillar.<br><br>Sure, there are exceptions both on cloud types and durations, but the properties above a characteristic.markohttp://www.ursa.fi/~riikonennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-46549297083420885042010-03-30T14:32:23.000-07:002010-03-30T14:32:23.000-07:00this is a great fit Jukka!and guess what, if you l...this is a great fit Jukka!<br>and guess what, if you look at the elliptical halos created by your crystal on the sun side, it looks a lot (but in smaller diameter) like the best picture of elliptical halo : http://www.astro-quebec.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=146<br>this is more than a strange coincidence to me!nicolas lefaudeuxnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-14846989269366887762010-03-30T14:59:44.000-07:002010-03-30T14:59:44.000-07:00Nicolas, thanks. The elliptical halo(s) around the...Nicolas, thanks. The elliptical halo(s) around the Sun with the above parameters are not quite satisfactory with the Québec-ellipse display. The largest ellipse is too small, for one thing. But, one can surely find parameters with which a reasonable match can be obtained. Only minuscule changes in apex angles are required to change the sizes of the resulting ellipses.<br><br>Is there a well defined, finite set of ellipse sizes out there? Or is it a continuum? Perhaps the latter is true. Then, there may not be correlation between two different displays, but a display with simultaneous occurence of Bottlinger and ellipse should be possible to explain with same crystal(s). In a perfect world that is...jukka ruoskanennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-30774848691344495442010-03-30T16:47:24.000-07:002010-03-30T16:47:24.000-07:00I wrestled with the Quebec display simulation for ...I wrestled with the Quebec display simulation for a while (and Les has also been working on it). That was still when Jukka had narrow column shaped sun in the simulation, which made the simulations look not so good with ellipses, should try again now as this issue has been corrected.markohttp://www.ursa.fi/~riikonennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-78186033736689156222010-03-30T18:28:40.000-07:002010-03-30T18:28:40.000-07:00That is about the best freakin example of Bottling...That is about the best freakin example of Bottlinger rings yet!!!Michaelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-80765951483612819002010-03-30T18:38:13.000-07:002010-03-30T18:38:13.000-07:00I also noticed a subparhelic circle as well passin...I also noticed a subparhelic circle as well passing through the subsun and the ringsMichaelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-53245350199846100732010-03-30T18:46:31.000-07:002010-03-30T18:46:31.000-07:00The faint horizontal line through the subsun is a ...The faint horizontal line through the subsun is a reflection of the window sill.Tim Stonehttp://pix.timsworlds.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-48257342531012683612010-03-31T03:46:19.000-07:002010-03-31T03:46:19.000-07:00The Quebec elliptical with a sim is on OPOD.The Quebec elliptical with a sim is on OPOD.Les Cowleyhttp://www.atoptics.co.uk/opod.htmnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-46761442488008012622010-03-31T20:18:57.000-07:002010-03-31T20:18:57.000-07:00I don't know if you guys remember but in March...I don't know if you guys remember but in March 23rd 2008 I got that elliptical halo display that lasted over 2 hours and I time-lapsed it and when I paged through the pics I could see the ellipse shrink and then grow when a large piece of precipitating AC drifted in front of the sun and it would form large ellipse with 2 inner rings and they would disappear as the outer main ellipse would shrink. Someone needs to point me to a freeware I can download so I can make a movie for you all to view. I know everyone in the halo community want to see a shrinking and expanding ellipse. Marko also said that display should be in the spotlight as well at the time.Michaelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1046232325583098770.post-62591643866194506132010-04-01T12:54:58.000-07:002010-04-01T12:54:58.000-07:00Thanks Glenn for the info. Some of us have probabl...Thanks Glenn for the info. Some of us have probably known about this, the photo is also (very poorly) reproduced in the Lynch et. al. paper, to which there is a link in the post. I have not seen Scorer's book, so it was nice to know what the figure caption says.marko riikonenhttp://www.ursa.fi/~riikonennoreply@blogger.com